Who wants a very nice bottle of Scotch and a dozen Roses?

**mistakes r crucial** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 12:53 AM

Hi all,

Last week I put up a post regarding our Albino's and the fact they were miles behind the other Discus in our grow out system. These fish have been driving us nuts for the last couple of months because even though I have some very experienced help/opinions up here when I need them no one can tell me what the problem is without sacrificing one at the vets. I will do that as a last resort but thought I would give the forum one last shot.

The main problem is if we don't fix these guys shortly they are going to be permanently stunted which would be a bit of a tradegy considering the standard of them, they are very nice fish. So, anyone that can give me a diagnosis and treatment to fix them gets one very nice bottle of scotch delivered to their door and if it's one of the ladies, a dozen red roses as well regardless of where you are.

Symptoms are plain and simple, won't eat much, will only touch live food in small amounts, aren't growing, virtually no belly but apart from that have colour and fins not clamped. They have all been treated over the last 10 weeks for flukes and worms with Prazi, Sterazin and Octazin for suspected flagellates. Not all at once I might add, over the 10 week period.

Rod suggested flagellates might be the first thing to look at so 3 days ago I split the 10 in to 2 groups of 5 and switched them off the system. I've treated one lot with a double dose of Sterazin and the second lot with Octazin, I won't really know the results of this for another week or so but no difference so far in any of them.

Here are some photos of them..

The water params are as follows:
Ph 6.8 : 6.9 and stable.
GH 5
KH 2 (sometimes less depending on council treatment)
Temp 28c -28.5c (stable)
W/C 50%-80% every other day.
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 5-10 depending on the day.

My apologies for the long post but I wouldn't have a bloody clue how to fixd these guys up.
MAC

**goldenpigeon** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 02:29 AM

ok here i go.
*god help me*
first r these guys in with any discus bigger than them? i know that you have treated for worms and all but it might be the case with them. are any other fish showing signs of stunted growth? who did you buy them off? try raising their tank to 31 degrees.

sorry bout the jumble of questions. i know i know how to fix it but i can remember.

**goldenpigeon** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 02:38 AM

also r they on the lean side? and if i can fix the promblem do i get the bottle of scotch?

**mistakes r crucial** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 02:40 AM

Junior,

They are on their own and from the same batch as all the rest from Singapore, no others have the same problem. We've had the temp up over 30c when treating with salt some time ago, no difference.
MAC

**mistakes r crucial** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 02:42 AM

How old are you Junior? That will be the deciding factor regarding the scotch lol!! I might have to send you the roses lmao!
MAC

**goldenpigeon** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 03:09 AM

no1 tell my age!!!! im over 18 ill leave it at that.
look i really hate to say this but i really think they must just be a bad batch

i think you should just sacrifice 1 to the vet and find out the problem

i mean after all you have done and they havnt come good. and no other fish are affected BUT the ALBINO'S.

**leanne31** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 03:26 AM

In about 4 years you might be junior. Have you tried raising the temp to about 32 to increase metabolism it might make them more hungry maybe they're just gonna be small fish.

leanne

**goldenpigeon** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 03:40 AM

no they should atleast grow to about 12cm. his tank is over 30

**goldenpigeon** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 03:47 AM

whats you W/C reigeme like? maybe do some larger than normal changes for a while. also can you feed them live brine shrimp? they might like them. are they very intimidated by other fish?

**Dee** · Mon Apr 25, 2005, 04:01 AM

Hi MAC,

I am in no way experienced with discus ailments (sp), but I had a very similar experience with 2 of my discus about a year ago. I would agree with Rod Lewis in that you may have a problem with flagellites (sp). I had the same symptoms you have described, for which I treated with Metro. If you decide to treat with Metro I would advise using the generic brand "metrogyl" in the 400mg tabs. Steer clear of liquid Metro for the reasons I posted in the Double Dosing Sterazin post. Here's a link to a URL I found very helpfull when I had my problems ...

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/spironucleus.php

The treatment that worked best for me was the 400mg/10G one listed in the URL link. I had treated at the lower dosage rate twice with no positive effect. I then treated at the 400mg/10g dosage and my fish where eating very well within a week. My fish had white poo which I dont think your's do, but my fish where only ever eating very small amounts of live food if any. This is only a suggestion, as I am not comfortable recommending medications etc for discus. If you decide to treat as per the URL keep the following in mind ...

1. Light out during treatment
2. Dose 3 times daily (every 8 hours) with 30% WC's

I hope this info helps, but please maybe get the opinions of more experienced discus keepers before trying this treatment. I found Metro to be very gentle on my my fish. One fish vet I spoke too about metro told me that metro in the higher doses can effect bio filter, I would tend to agree so keep up the water changes and remove bio filter for the duration of treatment. Anyway it worked for me ... good luck.

Cheers,

Dee

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