What do you guys think??

Hi All,
I too have a similar tank;

- 200ltr/55gal
- medium gravel
- 2-10~12cm Discus (that are doing brilliantly!!)
- 2-Med. to Large congo tetras (male)
- 2-10cm Clown Loaches
- 2-10cm Bristle nose catfish
- 2-med. Siamese Algae eaters
- 1- med. to Large Pearl Gourami
- 7-med. Cardinal Tetras
- 7-med. to large Rummy Nose Tetras
- In a heavily planted (Jebo Round style) tank
- 1- 2215 Eheim Canister Filter (with the pickup near the bottom and the outlet pointed diagonally towards the back of the tank, to get good water circulation, but not too turbulent and also have the outlet close to the top, to ripple the water to oxygenate it for the fish.
- I worked out a daily dose for each of my fertilizers("Seachem"; Excel, Potassium, Iron, Flourish)
- I add a waste control chemical to my tank once a week
- I also add a worked out daily dose of "Sera" Fishtamin vitamins.
- When I first planted, I used root fertilizers tablets (not too much) for each plant.
- I change 20% of my water every wednesday and weekend
- I change my white fine filter every week(where I get a very cheap alternative from clark rubber($15 for 1 by 1.5mtrs).
- water temp. 28.5~29'C
- Ph 6.7~6.8 (depending wether measured with lights on or off)
- Add Auburn Aquariums "Start Right B" (which is De-Ioniser & Electrolyte Salts) to new water
- Add Auburn Aquariums "Supa-Chlor Ammonia Remover" (which also removes Lime, Copper, Zinc, Aluminium and Iron) to new water.

Quite simply the plants and fish look great, I have no algae outbursts, the Ph is stable I have no Ammonia, no Nitrites, no greater than 20ppm of Nitrates and I have no Fatalities.
I hope all this woffelling helps somebody.

Many Kindly Fishy Regards
Jason

Hi Jason,

I would stick with what you have in there right now. Adding Discus to this tank would not really be good for them.
As has been said before, as a general rule of thumb, we say 10 gallons 45-50 liters per adult fish. I think if you want to go down the discus route, think about a minimal look, no plants, just wood roots and a thin sand bottom, this is much easier to handle and maintain.
Raising small discus of course is better done in a bare tank, but please ask for advice before you jump in.

H

Hi,
Hollowman, I don't need to add anymore discus to my tank I am happy as it is.

If you want to do a 50% water change every second day though thats your chose not mine!!

I was just making a point that one does not have to strain his back to maintain a rigorous water change program to keep happy healthy fish.

You don't have to grow discus out to 15 to 20cm to appreciate them.

BTW, I thought this section of the forum was called "The Amazon Garden".
Where's the amazon in a bare or near bare bottom tank!

And while I'm on a roll, (LOL!:) I am sick of the comments that recommend a 50% water change every second day, or for those real nutters, everyday!
I mean you can have a life and keep fish, surely!

Every time I go to any fish shop and say what was said in some of these forums about water changing, in regards to 50% or greater they nearly have to stop themselves from laughing.

I have spoken to fish shop owners who have kept fish themselves for over 20 years and said that you don't have to do this much maintainence. It is too much! You are likely to do more harm then good.

I am constantly told that a tank whose chemistry doesn't change too much is better left alone than chancing a chemistry change. SMALLER CHANGES!

I meant to add to my first posting by saying;
My lighting initially was very ordinary. I spruced it up a bit by changing my 3-30watt T8 Jebo globes with three Arcadia high performance 30watt T8 globes utilizing varying colour temps.
I also super glued some aluminium foil above the globes to get maximum flection of light that's available without upgrading to a more expensive option.

P.S. No offense intended. Just some things that need to be said.


Many Kindly Fishy Regards
Jason

I think you are having a laugh.

I even missed the fact you have discus, I would say you have been given wrong advice. You are well overstocked and yes, large water changes are needed to keep a healthy discus environment, fact. Have you heard of DOC's ?
Also again, who told you that the natural habitat of discus was heavily planted ? a lfs? it isn't, fact. Ask Heiko.

No offence intended, but I have never trusted the local fish shop owner, even if they have been in the trade for 20 years, they generally know nothing about the fish they trade, they don't need to. All they do is try to sell you 'wonder' products they you don't need, and where a water change will work better.

H

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gone Fishing

Hi,


BTW, I thought this section of the forum was called "The Amazon Garden".
Where's the amazon in a bare or near bare bottom tank!

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While I am on a 'roll' too,

Where is the Amazon in these fish:

Congo Tetra.............Origin.....Africa
SAE's.......................Origin.....Asia
Clown Loach.............Origin.....Indonesia

I rest my case.

Also, please read this :
http://www.simplydiscus.com/library/...habitats.shtml

H

You only have to look at the quality of discus at lps to know that most really don't know what they are talking about, they just think they do.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lpiasente

You only have to look at the quality of discus at lps to know that most really don't know what they are talking about, they just think they do.

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I totally agree with you Leanne :wink:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gone Fishing

If you want to do a 50% water change every second day though thats your chose not mine!!

I was just making a point that one does not have to strain his back to maintain a rigorous water change program to keep happy healthy fish.

BTW, I thought this section of the forum was called "The Amazon Garden".

And while I'm on a roll, (LOL!:) I am sick of the comments that recommend a 50% water change every second day, or for those real nutters, everyday!
I mean you can have a life and keep fish, surely!

Every time I go to any fish shop and say what was said in some of these forums about water changing, in regards to 50% or greater they nearly have to stop themselves from laughing.

I have spoken to fish shop owners who have kept fish themselves for over 20 years and said that you don't have to do this much maintainence. It is too much! You are likely to do more harm then good.

I am constantly told that a tank whose chemistry doesn't change too much is better left alone than chancing a chemistry change. SMALLER CHANGES!

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Jason,

Please respect the experts on this website, such as Hollowman, who have many years experience with discus.

the guys at most lfs' do not know how to keep discus well and this is proven by the consistantly bad condition of their stock, as Leanne says, which are mostly underfed and stunted due to poor conditions.

This forum, on the main part, is dedicated to keeping discus, and most of us on here are constantly learning from each other as new information becomes available on how to keep discus healthy and happy.

I do not appreciate you refering to experienced members of this forum who gladly give their time and knowledge to assist other aquarists as 'nutters'.

personally, if a guy (or girl) in an lfs laughed at my water change regime I would walk right out of their shop - not before I probably pointed to a number of sick fish that they were keeping as evidence of their lack of knowledge on the subject.

Sorry for the rant, but quite frankly your comments are misguided and the misinformation you have provided could lead to inexperienced aquarists loosing their fish at a great financial and emotional cost.

Your comments and attitude are not appropriate for this forum. Please learn some respect, and do your homework before dishing out bad advice and slagging off other members.

Robert.

heres my 2 cents.. please, take no offence.. I know Im pretty much a nobody on the site, but heres my thoughts over this thread..

first, WE ARE ALL still learning about the hobby, no matter how long we have been in it, or as a so called expert compared to someone else.
We all have mishaps, deaths, sickness, etc.. and we analyse it to death, cause we want to know.
As far as the thread here, I dont think anyone told him the natural habitat for discus is planted!! He just keeps plants with Discus..why?..is that wrong!..Doesnt sound like hes just purchased them from the Amazon.
If its working for him so be it!!.. good for him..
LESS is MORE.... I do it... smaller more freq water changes rather than sucking it all up, would be less stressful from what I see...
Ive had my Discus for few months now...they are growing well..no BB tank ..they look fine..
and as I have said in this forum before.. NOT ALL LFS are useless..and have staff that dont know a thing..I cant tell you how many times Ive talked ppl out of buying the chemicals etc, and told them do this instead..w/ch blaa blaa.. infact today and yesterday..they said thanks its all fine now ,what you recommended worked..
Im no Heiko and Ive no masters / chemistry degree, but I do have knowledge on the hobby as an employee, and give good advise.
I do think wilds would need much more attention, but I dont think that is the case here.. for years most Discus have come accustom to easier conditions..your the ones keeping the fish that need the work.

Im with Jason on this one.. :lol:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 1fish2fish3fish

WE ARE ALL still learning about the hobby, no matter how long we have been in it, or as a so called expert compared to someone else.
We all have mishaps, deaths, sickness, etc.. and we analyse it to death, cause we want to know.

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agreed :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 1fish2fish3fish

LESS is MORE.... I do it... smaller more freq water changes rather than sucking it all up, would be less stressful from what I see...
Ive had my Discus for few months now...they are growing well..no BB tank ..they look fine..

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good consistant water quality is everything for discus, and I agree that every effort should be taken with water changes to prevent dangerous swings in ph and temp :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 1fish2fish3fish

NOT ALL LFS are useless..and have staff that dont know a thing..I cant tell you how many times Ive talked ppl out of buying the chemicals etc, and told them do this instead..w/ch blaa blaa.. infact today and yesterday..they said thanks its all fine now ,what you recommended worked..

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I glad that you are one of the good ones, hopefully the information that you are learning about discus (along with the rest of us) will be passed on to your clients. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 1fish2fish3fish

most Discus have come accustom to easier conditions..your the ones keeping the fish that need the work.

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I disagree here. All Discus, whether wild or not, need good water conditions and regular maintanence - domestics are not an easy option.

R.