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  1. #1
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    Some doubts about discus, help please.

    Hello, I am new here, and I have some doubts (tried in other forum, but it looks nobody knew), it would be great if somebody with more experience could clarify them:

    1-I got a blue discus ill when I left my country, then, after arriving, I treated him and he totally recovered (now eating, fat, with a lot more color and very active). Nonetheless, the colour is still not what he had before. He is beautiful now, a lot more colour than when he was sick, but before he used to be more blue. The doubt is: is he going to recover the colour or when this happens there is no way back?.

    2-I got time ago two albinos, one was red cover and AMG (young). The red one started to lose its colour, it looks that the seller (from USA) uses carotyll for the red, which was a bit dissapointing because I do not use any kind of colorants, I like more the natural colour they could get with natural products (i feed them with: dried blackworms, Cobalt pro breeder flakes, dried beefheart, Nutrafin for discus, live earthworms (daily), live artemia (daily), live daphnia, live zophoba worms, and some mussels on the weekends). My doubt here is: how a great albino red cover should look like without carotyll?, or they are always not that red and the only way to have them red is with carotyll?.

    3-I have heard that AMG become orange if you feed them with pellet, all indicates that this happens with the red enhancer carotyll. My doubt is: all AMG full yellow are maintained with carotyll?. Mine is yellow, some orange coloration but more yellow, and the head is white. Should I expect a full yellow or without artificial colorants it is not going to happen?.

    Graphic explanation:




    Ok, as you can see in the image, you see the three of them.

    -the blue one was really very blue, I went to Colombia for 1 month in September and after I arrived it was sick, so I medicated it with metro and all was fine afterwards. But the color never totally recovered as you can see in the next photos. I dont think he can change colour so fast (comparing with the normal change in the color while a fish is growing), and just after a desease, so it is more like the desease affected the color of the fish, and my doubt is if he will recover the beautiful blue or not, achieving the full potential he was appearing to show.

    -the AMG has its head White. My doubt is: can I achieve full yellow coloration without artificial colorants as carotyll?

    -The albino red cover is really red. Not that red afterwards. So, what can I expect from a real albino red cover or if all of them are always maintained with carotyll and colorants.



    -look at this photo above, this is how the blue one looks like now. The color is still nice, but it dramatically changed, in the head is very noticiable.



    Look how the albino red cover looks like above, he is not red cover animore . Now it is even more paled. Both sides were equally red at the begining.

    Thanks!!!

  2. #2
    Moderator
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    Hi, & welcome to the forum.

    You still have some beautiful fish even with the colour fading, sure many here would be pleased to own them.

    I see your concern with the colour and unfortunately many breeders do enhance the fish's natural colour with chemicals. Your BD. I think will improve with time, if it was a stronger blue and lost its intensity after the treatment then give it time. For the Covers, have you considered feeding Krill? You can mix in with your beefheart or feed separately. Krill has natural red enhancing affects so might help return the lost colour.

    Hth

    H
    Why me ?

  3. #3
    Wrigglers
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    Hello and welcome;
    I am using tetra color tropical granules for many years ,it says on the box that it has got natural color enhancer ,i am quite happy with it ,the only short coming is that if you feed it to your yellow discus it changes to orange also if you feed it to snow white diamond discus it changes to milky white but for red base discus there is no problem.
    good luck
    sayid

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hollowman View Post
    Hi, & welcome to the forum.

    You still have some beautiful fish even with the colour fading, sure many here would be pleased to own them.

    I see your concern with the colour and unfortunately many breeders do enhance the fish's natural colour with chemicals. Your BD. I think will improve with time, if it was a stronger blue and lost its intensity after the treatment then give it time. For the Covers, have you considered feeding Krill? You can mix in with your beefheart or feed separately. Krill has natural red enhancing affects so might help return the lost colour.

    Hth

    H
    Thanks for the welcome and the help!

    Hey, doubt: krill could make the AMG orange or not?.

    Just for general infom I would like to list the current food I use for them: zophobas worms (live, each 3 days), artemia (live, all days), earthworms (live, all days), Cobalt Probreeder flakes (all days), Nutrafin for discus (each 2 days), dried blackworms with dried beefheart (daily), frozen mussels each weekend, and thats it.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by sayid View Post
    Hello and welcome;
    I am using tetra color tropical granules for many years ,it says on the box that it has got natural color enhancer ,i am quite happy with it ,the only short coming is that if you feed it to your yellow discus it changes to orange also if you feed it to snow white diamond discus it changes to milky white but for red base discus there is no problem.
    good luck
    sayid
    Thanks man. Yes, thats the problem actually, I dont want to lose the AMG. If I dont use red enhancer, the red will remain as it is (still nice, actually the seller who imported offered me to change it, but I already love him, thats is a big problem to me, it is really hard to me to remove a fish from my tank), and the AMG could keep the nice yellow. If I use it, the red will look pretier, but the AMG will be AMO (albino millenium orange )

  6. #6
    Hi and welcome!
    Your fish are lovely, hope you get the help you need here

  7. #7
    Wrigglers
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    Donethur; you have not said where you live ,but i am not familiar with the brands of food that you are using having said that i am worried that you are using live food for your discus not only that but so many different live food ,in Australia we don't use live earth worm you may as well play Russian rullet ,they are full of parasites and sooner or later you have to deal with a tank full of sick and dying fish ,i know in Asia they feed it to discus because it is cheap but it's risky .
    Regarding natural colour enhancers the other food which i can mention is spirulina which is an algae and i add that to my home made beef heart and it does not change the fish orange ,you can buy them on line and its made by SERA and is used for blue discus .
    hope this helps
    sayid

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by sayid View Post
    Donethur; you have not said where you live ,but i am not familiar with the brands of food that you are using having said that i am worried that you are using live food for your discus not only that but so many different live food ,in Australia we don't use live earth worm you may as well play Russian rullet ,they are full of parasites and sooner or later you have to deal with a tank full of sick and dying fish ,i know in Asia they feed it to discus because it is cheap but it's risky .
    Regarding natural colour enhancers the other food which i can mention is spirulina which is an algae and i add that to my home made beef heart and it does not change the fish orange ,you can buy them on line and its made by SERA and is used for blue discus .
    hope this helps
    sayid
    Hi sayid,

    Thanks for your input.

    Well, I am from Chile, sorry for not mentioning it. Regarding live food, the only one that may represent a "risk" is the earth worm as you said. Nonetheless, you dont know what I do and I have some contra arguments actually.

    Well, first I cut them all in smaller parts. Then I wash them A LOT to remove all the earth inside. This + chlorine in the tap water, I think represents a safe enough food for them. On the other hand, you have several breeders that feed them like this (bloodworms specially), and successful ones. Dont you think that this may represent something different?. I mean, if this would really matter, then they should have big losses, correct?. I think the fish itself has defenses, thats the explanation, and I think it is equally Russian rulet if you put your fish in a bubble where no illness exist, as at fist contact with them, they wont be able to defend against the new bacteries or protozoa. On the other hand, I think there is enough bacteries in the aquarium, because of the descomposition of the organic matter (waste, plants, food, etc.), not sure how bad it is to have actually a bit of bacteria inside. I think the most important thing is the water quality. That explains the success of the Asian breeders, and why I dont get discus sick (the case of the blue one is identified as exception, as I wasnt in my home, and the person in charge wasnt appropiate for the task). The evidence of this is: every single case of disease in discus I have seen is because water quality or stress (or a protozoa coming from a different already infected tank). Nothing related to food actually. Good water quality should keep the fish healthy, and thats only what matters in my opinion. Considering that logic, I think it may be better to give them a good quality food as earth worm, than a less quality food as dried food, or even the beefheart may have more fat than this, and it is actually a lot more dirty, which causes a lot of organic matters to be discomposed, which means more bacteries. I think at the end, it may even be the same or very similar.

    It is easy for me to remove earthworm from the diet, as I have other alternatives more "clean". Nonetheless, there is a particular reason why I chose to keep them, after trying a lot: they are easy to breed, and the most important thing: not sure what the earth worm has (red earth worms, here they cal it "Californian worm"), but after they eat it they increase the natural colours a lot, but A LOT, more tan anything else. They start to mark territory, it looks their energy increases a lot. Also, they love them, more than anything I used before. I used to have a P. Altum, but I hasd to remove it as after eating earth worms, the Altum started to attack to the blue discus (the Altum variety has some blue color on it). So, something happens with this food that help them because of their vital energy. I have seen more grow rate and better behavior, all of them keep claiming a place in the shoal (some shy discus are not that shy now).

    Finally, I dont get why you say that giving them so many different food may affect. Can you clarify this?, how variety means bad and why?.


    Regarding spirulina, nice, thanks. I have it but dried, not the same than live I imagine. Does this increases an specific colour?, or all of them?.

    Rgds,
    Last edited by donethur; Wed Nov 23, 2016 at 01:08 PM.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sabrina View Post
    Hi and welcome!
    Your fish are lovely, hope you get the help you need here

    Thanks Sabrina

    I hope it too, but I think I had advances. At least now I have hope for the blue one, looks like I need to be more patient. Regardiong the albinos, I just want to know what to expect of a red albino without carotyll. Is there at least one???. And if the AMGs have the head yellow because of the carotyll or if they naturally will be full yellow.

  10. #10
    Your welcome Donethur! I cant answer those questions though as i dont know the right answer sorry.. I would think that with good care, clean water and good food their colors will come back or be as good as they can be naturally

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