whose responsibility ..

[JT]

HI

just got some question need to ask.

If i bought 2 discus from other state and i pick those package up from airport and got home and figure they are dead. Is this seller's responsibility or my fault.? It's my first time buying Discus from other state so i did speak to seller carefully before i proceed the purchase and he mention everything to me and want me to call him when fish arrived and i did.

They are package one in each bag. However when i open the foam box and took them out, they already dead in the bag, and i tried to rescue them by putting them in the tank still it's dead.

Now seller is sort of blaming the AAE rough handling or my rough car of causing those Discus death.
Generally speaking, if someone buying fish from other state and they arrive dead, whose responsibility and how are these issue gona be solved ??


thanks

[para]

Have you and the seller agreed for refund for DOA?
Cheers

[JT]

he said he worn't refund me the money.

Because he said it's not his fault, he send it healthy and blaming might AAE's rough handling or my drive. He also said he only sell few discus and doesn't run a business so he is not responsible for this issue.

[Xtreme]

Hi there,

Where the fish double bagged atleast

Was the much water ,and was there plenty of oxygen in the bags when you opened the box?

Also did you take some pics of them after you opened the box,
as you will need them, and can you post them if possible

HTH

[JT]

hi

i bought 2 discus from this guy. One discus in one bag. so they were separated.

When i open the foam box. water was around less than half in one bag. And both bags were really that full with oxygen in it. it was sort of loosen.

Took picture when i open the discus bag with me holding the bag and fish is dead. i can send you pic to post here coz i don't know how to post up pic.

cheers

[JT]

pic

[OZFISH]

Hi,

I have only ever had discus delivered twice. The first time from Adelaide, one of the 3 fish i purchased was very lathargic when i got it home but the others were in good condition. After a few days all were healthy and now 12 months later they are doing great.

My other time was 12 discus from Cairns. They were 4 pairs plus 4 others. They were bagged together 2 in each bag. When they arrived i found 1 dead on arrival (the biggest pair ) and the rest were ok but ragged, cut, dammaged etc generally as i think being 2 in a bag they were hitting each other and the plane trip, car trip and handling would have made them bang into each other. Now a few months later the dead on is obviously still dead, 10 of them are very healthy and looking great and 1 other is not eating and looks like it will die in the next week or so. The guy who sent them did a great job double bagging them, put rubber between the bags, filled with oxygen and even oxygen stones in the bag. Even so, i think 1 hour longer in the bags and several of the others may not have made it.

My guess is that they are safe in bags generally for around 2-4 hours. 4 - 6 hours you have a good chance. Longer than 6 hours then unless the person packing them is extremely good and put in lots of oxygen, prime and so on then you might be in trouble. That includes time from puting in the bag, taking to airport, waiting for the flight, the flight, waiting for then to get collected, the trip home and then the time until the first water change in the bag. I know its a lot longer when fish are shipped from overseas to quarantine but ive also seen a lot of dead fish in quarantine tanks.

I have also had several experiences with marine fish as i have several marine tanks as well and found that marine fish have a higher chance of being DOA.

After all that, I think that usually in these cases its buyer beware as long as the seller has taken reasonable precautions to ensure the fish were well packed and left as little time as possible in the bags before leaving the airport. I guess its like when something is lost in the mail, its the buyers problem and not the sellers.

I am sorry for your loss and i know how heart breaking it is to have a fish DOA. I'm usually very very reluctant to get fish from interstate unless they are from very trusted and experienced sellers who have shipped fish several times before or organise help from someone who has.

On the other hand ive received lots of snakes from interstate and never lost a snake from shipping yet. They are very good travellers.

Kevin.

[bubblebobble2]

Hi,
Here's my 2 cents worth. The discus in pics look quite large and the bags might not hv sufficient oxygen. Bags might hv loosen abit cause of the air pressure but should not be flatten like the pics, unless both bags had already been opened. Did the AAE packaging include fragile and fish/livestock stickers? Cause I'm very sure that the handling would be extra careful with these stickers. My best best would be not enough oxygen cause with proper oxygen, they should last for atleast 12 hrs. Sorry for your loss and my guess would be normal air rather than oxygen used in those bags.

[Dan`]

unfortunately unless you had arranged a DOA agreement BEFORE you paid for the fish, its all your problem. seller has no need to refund etc no matter if they packed them properly or not.

buyer beware.

[JT]

thanks guys.

when those two discus arrive. the bag was bit loose , one bag has around 1/3 water and the other one is around 1/4 water in the bag and not much oxygen in it.
Two discus are around 12- 13 cm include tail.

There are AAE's fish/livestock stickers on the foam box. and it's sealed. I dont' think bag has been opened before it arrived.

Each fish are placed in 3 layers of plastic bag. Therefore, unless the seller did not pump oxygen into each of the bags, otherwise, i don't see any reason the oxygen would have gone from the bag.