thin discus

[pikeman]

hello :D my female discus looks very thin around her head and is n ot as active as normal
i have treated with flubenol 2 days ago but no sign of improvement
please help :cry: :cry:

[samir]

any chance of a pic ? is it eating ?

[pikeman]

hi it eats but then spit some of it back out thats why i thought flukes :?

[*Chris*]

its lloks likean internal infestation id worm them with levimisole
( BIG L PIG AND POULTRY)
at a dose rate of 1ml per 7ltrs
that should do the trick she should be eating in no time
EXAI

[pikeman]

i have used flubenol and that said for worms aswell

[*Chris*]

flubenzol is no good for some worms mate
try the levimisole and see how you go
it is the most effective method if she still wont eat then try feeding her some live black worm that usually gets any discuss appetite back
EXAI

[pikeman]

can i get that in the uk :D

[pikeman]

this is what i used http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=018&item=280028425594&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWN%3AIT&rd=1

[*Chris*]

that stuff will only treat taoeworm and not geardia or camillanus worms
i would not know if you could get it in the uk
id assuem so
try your local grain store or farm supplies depending on where you live in the uk LOL
otherwise just ask a vet for some levimisole they should have some on hand
EXAI

[pikeman]

i will try that then thankyou :D :D
does it affect any fish or filters as mines a community tank

[*Chris*]

no it doesnt
but always when adding medications if the fish start to act funny gasp for air or bloat make sure you doa water change and that is for any medication
cheers
EXAI

[pikeman]

could i use prazi pro as i can easily obtain this

[Merrilyn]

You need to ask your pet shop for something to eliminate round worm and thread worm in fish.

One of the active ingredients is usually levamisole.

The prazi pro you are talking about is for flukes and tape worms I think. Read the label and see if it treats threadworm too.

[pikeman]

thanks for all your help
my vets are getting me some levamisole so the discus should be back to normal like in the pic :D :D
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f208/polypterus/fishpics186.jpg

[*Chris*]

nice polypterus :thumb

[mcloughlin2]

You should always have worming medication on hand when keeping discus ... :wink:

I have found that discus are particularly prone to getting worms .. I recommend treating ANY new discus with levimisole ... :P

[pikeman]

right ok i have now got the levamiasol and the vets said it was 0.7 ml for 5-7 liters is this right
it says change after 24 hours surely this cant mean all the water
what happens to me if i swalow some when doing a water change after treatment
how long does it last in the water
thankyou :D

[*Chris*]

well if thats what the vet says then go with
it
and yeah try not to swallow the levimisole :P:
25% water change will be alright
that is strange though because we put
1ml per 7ltrs and water change at the end of the week
hmmm
all well the vet know best
EXAI

[geo/discus breeder]

live black worm is one of the worst food for your discus i used to have a group of 6 discus i fed them live black worm two times a week and 3 of the discus got really skinny i asked a couple of people they said it was because the black worms get stuck in there tiny digestive tracked so it isn't good for them if you wan't to faten them up

blood wormes arn't very good either for the same reson

[*Chris*]

that is a load of crap .....
live worms can be fed without problems
to any fish as long as they are clean and lively
the problems with live worms is they carry pathogens ocasionaly that is again why a regular worming cycle is recommended for your discus regardless of what foods you feed
EXAI

[geo/discus breeder]

how many fish vets have you been talking to about discus digestive system

most noligebel discus keepers will never even feed blood worms to discsus they don't carry any desises but there digestive system can't handle it

blood worms, black worms won't harm your discus in the short term but it will in the long tern

thats why best things for your discus are brine shimp, small pelets and beef heart if the right additives are there

[*Chris*]

ok so most knowledgable discus keepers....
hmmm i can see a few knowledgable discus keepers on this forum and know a few if not half dozen will feed live worms with no problem what so ever
the only fish vet that argues the point about bloodworms and live worms is doctor greenwood and he is an absolute nob too
your telling me that a discus doesnt eat bugs and harder things in the wild ?????
having said that i know that they are the furthest thing away from there wild forms
i have fed and continue to feed my discus live worms
and i also continue to worm my discus regularly too
as a precaution
the only problem i have had is discus refussing to eat anything else if they get to fussy
so when posting your oppinion mate try not to generalise on who in your oppinion does and does not feed things
EXAI

[goldenpigeon]

geo discus breeder,
did you know that brine shrimp actually have quite a hard shell as opposed to a mysis shrimp?

the problem starts when you are feeding worms, or any live/frozen food for that matter, that has been contaminated by parasites etc.

i myself dont really ever feed live black worms to my discus for a number of reasons. first, i dont trust any LFS at all, i cant guarentee that the great live worms they have this week are as goodquality as the worms this week. and second i cant really afford to feed my fish live worms as i have other things to spend my money on.


i have used blood worms with excellent success and still continue too. blood worms are fed to discus world wide and i have never heard of people having problems with them. have you got anything such as a report, test results etc to prove what you are saying and im quite interested and will be proven otherwise by strength of arguement. you know vets aren't always correct you know ;)


the discus in the amazon eat insects, bugs etc that exist within their enviroment in black water which is slow flowing (great enviroment for larvae) and sheltered. its not like cattle frequently fall into the river and drown and the fish go for the heart straight away. there are not brine shrimp or sinking pellets in the amazon. and as discus grown into adult hood the become almost completely carnivorous.


when we bring wild discus into captivity (australia for example) do we have the natural rood they have in the amazon? most likely not. so what do we feed them? the wild discus are less likely to take to some processed food. a live or frozen worm would me much more appealing dont you think? :D

[samir]

if you have used Flubendazole or flubenol then you do not need to use levimasole. dont worry about feeding blackworms or bloodworms, as long as they are from a clean source its ok. try avoiding live food just to be extra safe. keep diet varied. i dont know who's right or wrong regarding live food, i guess its better to be safe than sorry.
is your discus eating ? what colour is the droppings ? how many water changes do you do a week ?
if all your water parameters are fine, your fish should be hungry all the time, if thats not the case maybe a medicated flake containing metronidazole would be better in this case.

[samir]

have you got anything such as a report, test results etc to prove what you are saying
:D
hmmm sounds awfully familiar :lol: :lol: :lol:

[geo/discus breeder]

i don't have any articals to proove my view but most of the time when i speak to noligeble discus keepers about food when i said i feed blood worms they jumped at me and said stay away from worms

i no many people use blood worms sucsessfully but i don't think it's the best food for discus

[Mulisha]

Do earthworms have nasties in them? Are earthworms good for fishys ?

8-)

[goldenpigeon]

lol samir, yeh man i threw that in there cause i knew EX would like it haha.

geo/discus breeder,
so you cant prove that they are potentially harmful to the fish (assuming your feeding clean worms)? people will tell you to stay away from them because almost no one will be cultureing their own so you would have to buy them from an LFS, so you cant rely on 100% clean worms.

if you were culturing them yourself (and you had a clean culture) then there is no reason why they would not be ok for the fish.

you dont think blood worms are the best food for discus. ok, well we know that they are fine (my results and many others). its probably best to put "IMO" if your giving advice on something that people have already established as being ok. you dont think they are good food, ok thats YOUR oppinion, BUT THEY ARE A FINE FOOD FOR DISCUS, so in this case you need to let people know that its you oppinion your giving them, not facts.

im not having a shot at you mate but more just exploring the topic really.


Rick i heard that fish love earth worms and i also heard the worms actually eat people, i would encourage you to stay away form them :D

[Mulisha]

Can u feed discus frogs?

[goldenpigeon]

why dont you try it and see how it goes?

[Nathan]

i myself feed my discus live blackwroms, i only get em from the one palce as i trust there quality an have never had an issue.

ive been feeding em for about a year, never had an issue an they love em, an excellent protein boost every couple weeks.

i dont feed them live bloodworms as i believe that can lead to intestinal blockages due to there skeletal shape.

anyway i guess its not a rule whether to feed them live worms or not, if u feel u want to an its good for them, then do so, if not then dont.

btw ive found with quite a few vets they dont really know what there tlkn about when it comes it discus especially, unless they have kept them there selves there knowledge is purely textbook, not experience.

anyway really sorry if i got a bit off track from the thread.

an updated pic or update would be great

[geo/discus breeder]

its only my opinion it is the opinon of two diifferent lfs owners that have studied about fishes digestive system and they said worms are fine for most but are is not good bad for discus for 2 resons 1 because LIVE worms and liv food in general can carrie bad parasites and 2 because there digestive system is not able to cope eith it as much

i no many peoples discus are fine with worms but not the best in the long run

find a fish vet mabye at borionia aquarium sometimes and ask for your self

all i am saying is i stay away fom worms

[Nathan]

fair enough then, yea you can run into trouble with worms carrying pathogens an other nasties, but if u get em from a good supply they should be ok.

but wouldnt discus eat lots of worms an similar things in the wild?

[Nathan]

double post sorry

[goldenpigeon]

ok i can see your point your making. if you were feeding worms as a staple or very frequently then you might be able to run into a bit of trouble. if its only a few times a week or something then the fish should be fine with it.

[geo/discus breeder]

discus don't eat worms in the wild they eat little tings like rotifers and cyclops

it's not just that live worms can have bad things in them it's that discus digestive system can't handle worms very well because there digestive system is very small compaired to other fish of there size so iv'e been tols not to feed worms in any form

spot on goldenpigeon

[samir]

pikeman what news of you fish ???

[pikeman]

hello when i gave the treatment white feaces were coming out was this good?
i cant see much change really :(

[samir]

what treatment did you give ?? i suggest stop everything and give metro.

[pikeman]

i gave levamisole in the dose the vet said
what is metro xan i get it in the uk

[*Chris*]

metro is short for metronidozole
it is a very strong antibiotic
it cures hexamita and hexamita caused hole in head
can also help with certain flaglettes
you should again be able to get it from your vet but it does carry a hefty price tag
EXAI

[samir]

is it eating at all ? after your levimasole dose you need to change the water to get the medication out. i'l browse around for metro and let you know. let me know if its eating

[pikeman]

i will do a water change today
it seems to have more of an appetite now :D

[*Chris*]

great to hear mate
good luck
EXAI

[pikeman]

done a water change but now both discus not just the ill one are very skittish but they werent before :(

[*Chris*]

thats ok mate give them time
it may take a while for them to feel comfortable again
especially after treatments
EXAI

[samir]

done a water change but now both discus not just the ill one are very skittish but they werent before :(
thats the levimasole, you will need to do another big water change. try not to make any sudden movements around the tank. when you remove the levimasole from the water they will get back to normal

[pikeman]

ok thanks will do :D
why does it do that

[*Chris*]

id assume they do it because they are scared they know there is something in the tank that should not be there but they dont know what it is or it could be something in the chemicals that make them do it
EXAI

[gro]

(these symptoms sound kinda familiar, have one that is hiding away, and the other had a huge white poo the other day) - does the levimasole treat both symptoms

also to get rid of the meds does throwing in a carbon bag for 30 days help